Curse

angelsarc · Jul 04, 2009, 12:10 AM // 00:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by poasiods

So, what you're saying is that since you feel like Barbs is underpowered in comparison to MoP, you want to buff it by giving it 1 second casting time... but you want to nerf it at the same time by extending the recharge time to 10?

First of all, Barbs and MoP have very different uses. MoP comes in handy in PvE if you chance to see enemies piling up together. Barbs, on other hand, allows you to go through individual targets or bosses faster. More importantly, when it comes to PvP, MoP is fairly useless while Barbs can enhance spikes very nicely. It's silly to seek changes in Barbs by comparing numbers with MoP, as they each are useful in different scenarios.

Barbs has the potential to output some serious damage in a spike, thus, the 2 second cast time to prevent it from being used to set-up spikes too easily. In exchange, the 5 second recharge time allows it to be used fairly frequently.

Guys, calm down. This is the same guy that wanted Barrage to have a 5s recharge.

Sniper22 · Jul 04, 2009, 12:33 AM // 00:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Helix Dreadlock

Yes, but you aren't realizing my point.

[B]IT IS NOT HOW THE SKILLS WORK, OR HOW EFFECTIVE THEY ARE, IT IS THE CASTING TIME[B/]
There is no sense in affecting one target at casting time of 2, when MoP has a casting time of 1.

CAN I GET SOME SERIOUS PEOPLE HERE PLEASE?

Learn to pvp.

If I ever see mark of pain casted on a target... I'll just move away from that target. Bam thats 10 energy wasted that will deal 0 damage, GG. Barbs, currently run on OP Me/N fast cast curses in GvG, can create a lot of pressure and damage and it's reliable to actually deal damage on a target. Barbs is also strong because it has only a 5 second recharge while the hex duration lasts 30 seconds. A one second casting time would make this skill harder to interrupt and it would be more spamable, and much more spamable from those Me/N.

Antares Ascending · Jul 04, 2009, 02:09 AM // 02:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Helix Dreadlock

Yes, but you aren't realizing my point.

[B]IT IS NOT HOW THE SKILLS WORK, OR HOW EFFECTIVE THEY ARE, IT IS THE CASTING TIME[B/]
There is no sense in affecting one target at casting time of 2, when MoP has a casting time of 1.

CAN I GET SOME SERIOUS PEOPLE HERE PLEASE?

We are getting your point. You, on the other hand don't seem to get the point that most people don't see a problem. There are many skill that target a single foe that take 2 seconds to cast. Both spells have their uses and it seems most people see this. No, 2 seconds is not bad. If anything MOP should be longer...not that I would like to see that, but it would be a better argument.

Ec]-[oMaN · Jul 04, 2009, 02:27 AM // 02:27

Do what you want with it in PvE, that is all.....

Chthon · Jul 04, 2009, 03:56 AM // 03:56

OP's ideas are really terrible.

MoP on a faster recharge would be overpowered. As it is now, it's very strong with the elite slot and secondary profession dedicated to solving the recharge problem. Trading the recharge problem for a cast time problem that could be easily solved by mindbender would strengthen the skill too much.

Barbs on a slower recharge would ruin the skill. It needs to be ready to go once per monster.

Also, the long cast time on Barbs serves an important purpose -- it makes it much harder to time a spike. Remove that limitation and the skill becomes overpowered.

RotteN · Jul 04, 2009, 11:43 AM // 11:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unreal Havoc

Can't spike with Mark of Pain? Here is a working team build that utilizes Mark of Pain and Hundred Blades to produce a devastating team spike and achieve a 19 minute clear of FOW on HM.

You're talking about PvE ... Just because something dies fast in PvE doesn't make your build a spike build.

The fact that MoP doesn't affect your target makes it useless to a spike build (since spike = single target massive damage burst). I don't see any problem with the skill either. MoP certainly doesn't need any nerfing, and barbs sees play as it is.

Don't try to "fix" stuff that's not broken.

Helix Dreadlock · Jul 04, 2009, 01:37 PM // 13:37

==close request==

Nobody is getting my point.

Tyla · Jul 04, 2009, 02:26 PM // 14:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Helix Dreadlock

Yes, but you aren't realizing my point.

[B]IT IS NOT HOW THE SKILLS WORK, OR HOW EFFECTIVE THEY ARE, IT IS THE CASTING TIME[B/]
There is no sense in affecting one target at casting time of 2, when MoP has a casting time of 1.

CAN I GET SOME SERIOUS PEOPLE HERE PLEASE?

People are being serious. You're also pretty bad if you really believe this. It's one target, but look at the recharge. Buffing the cast time will only imbalance it in the PvP area, unless you throw it into a split and shorten the casting time in PvE, but you know what? It's a wonderful skill in PvE as it is. Mark of Pain also has a casting time of one and works on an AoE level is balanced out by its high recharge time, which as opposed to Barbs, is 25 seconds longer.

If you think people just aren't getting your point, type it out in a different way until we "get your point".

gameshoes3003 · Jul 05, 2009, 07:15 AM // 07:15

Sometimes it's difficult to get another thing adjacent to your target with Mark of Pain.
And if no one is right next tot he hexed foe, it's a useless hex. But it has potential so you cannot spam it often.
Barbs on the other hand will also allow extra damage no matter what without an adjacent foe condition and you can spam it onto other targets.
So that's why the times are set as such and I think they are fair as is.

WhiteAsIce · Jul 05, 2009, 07:55 AM // 07:55

Barbs is easy to trigger - all you have to do is attack the hexed foe.
MoP is slightly harder to trigger - you have to clump up the foes for it to work. Since that requires more work, you're rewarded for doing so with more damage.

It's balanced the way it is now. No need to change. You need more work to get foes to stay in a clumped group. Naturally, you get better results from doing so.

Enon · Jul 05, 2009, 07:55 AM // 07:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Helix Dreadlock

Nobody is getting my point.

That's because your point isn't logical, even though you claim it is. Why 'fix' something that isn't broken?

Exactly.

FengShuiDove · Jul 05, 2009, 08:10 AM // 08:10

Yes, everyone understands what you're saying but are rightfully disagreeing. You can't look at one aspect of two different skills and say that one is unfairly beneficial. Skills are balanced around all factors, energy cost, activation time, and recharge time being prevalent among them but not mutually exclusive. Here are 2 reasons why your argument (which I understand perfectly well) is flawed:

1. The skills are intended for different purposes. As mentioned and shown, Mark of Pain can be incredibly effective in team spike builds revolving around multiple hits on the hexed target in mob-heavy PvE areas, whereas Barbs can be incredibly effective in a PvP setting where the additional pressure it pushes on a single target can make or break a small spike or a push (this can also be said of Minion Masters and physical heavy teams in PvE).

2. The skills are fundamentally balanced by not only their casting time, but by energy cost and recharge as well. The point is pretty clear. You can't say Mark of Pain's 30 second recharge is negligible "because Assassin's Promise makes quick work of that." Sure, the skill has great synergy with Assassin's Promise, but Barbs synergizes well with physical heavy teams and allows you to bring an elite besides AP (think OotV for physical teams or Spiteful Spirit for a general hex/Curser).

Serious enough for you? Or does seriousness = agreement all of a sudden?